Licensing and new 48 core system

[matvdl]

I am looking at purchasing a new AMD 4 socket system with 12 cores per socket and therefore 48 cores. The system is going to be used primarily for R&D work and software testing and development.

Will I be able to run the free version of ESXi on this system - or will it not allow this if I have 48 processors??

Another option is to install Windows 2008 Enterprise (via our MSDN licensing) and than run VMWare server on this - but I am not sure if this will work either. This may actually be preferred as it will give me a location to test and run high-end software that may require a large number of processors, while still allowing a large number of other operating systems to work under VMWare Server.

I need to know what I can and can't do - as it is not a production server but an development machine I can't justify large licensing costs.

Thanks so much for your help in advance

[AndreTheGiant]

ESX and ESXi has a limit on the max number of core per socket.

See: http://www.vmware.com/products/vsphere/buy/editions_comparison.html

In your case you need the Advanced or the Enterprise Plus edition.

Andre

[matvdl]

Does that mean that I will not be able to run VMWare server or VMWare ESXi on any system with a 12 core processor??

Or does it mean that it will only use 6 cores of the 12 core processor??

[JimKnopf99]

There is a maximum per Host. 64 logical procs incl. HT.

If you want to use all your cpu incl. cores, you need to by more licenses per host.

In Your case 48 / 12 = 4

Frank

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[AndreTheGiant]

Or does it mean that it will only use 6 cores of the 12 core processor??

Yes, there is this limit on some ESX/ESXi edition.

For VMware Server, if your host OS can see 48, thant you can use them.

The limit is on physical cores NOT on logical processor (aka HyperThread on Intel).

PS: if you found some posts helpful then please leave some points :smileywink:

Andre

[matvdl]

Ok - so definitive answers are:

Yes I can install the free installation of ESXi on a server with 4 sockets and 12 cores per socket - but will not be able to fully utilize all cores?

AND

Yes - I can install free VMWare Server on a win 2008 Enterprise server with 4 sockets and 12 cores per socket without any limitations to how it is used?

Is this correct - before I purchase I want to make sure I can do what I need to be able to do.

[JimKnopf99]

No, your will not be able to use 4 cores and 12 cores per socket with the free installation of ESXi.

Because of the limitation of 6 cores per socket.

And the second one i don´t know.

Frank

If you find this information useful, please award points for "correct" or "helpful".

[AndreTheGiant]

Yes I can install the free installation of ESXi on a server with 4 sockets and 12 cores per socket - but will not be able to fully utilize all cores?

I haven't tried.

Yes - I can install free VMWare Server on a win 2008 Enterprise server with 4 sockets and 12 cores per socket without any limitations to how it is used?

I haven't tried. But VMware Server does not scale so good as ESX... you can can have some issue.

I suggest to use a licensed ESX/ESXi , or start using the evaluation mode (that will work, if your system is in HCL).

Andre

[matvdl]

So,

YES - VMWare server can be used on a 48 core system - but is not an ideal solution

Are we able to confirm that this is definitely the case before I take the plunge,

By the way - the license to support the full 48 cores with 4 sockets would be more expensive than the actual system - very costly for a development/trial system.

Also - what is HCL??

[AndreTheGiant]

HCL is the Hardware Compatibility List:

http://www.vmware.com/resources/compatibility

For VMware Server in the official guide (http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vmserver2.pdf) there is not info about a limit on the max number of cores.

Andre

[matvdl]

Thanks for all your help,

Does anyone now definitively if I can install VMWare Server onto a 4 socket - 48 processor system?

[RParker]

Does anyone now definitively if I can install VMWare Server onto a 4 socket - 48 processor system?'

VM Ware server is part of Windows. If windows sees it VM Ware server can use it. You can still only use 2 vCPU PER VM, regardless of how many cores there are on the host.

[matvdl]

Thanks all for your help,

These limitations are very significant for VMWare - 8 core and 12 core processors are now available and for about 3k you can build a dual socket with 12 cores. Inability to run VMWare without forking out big dollars is a real limitation.

This limitation also applies to a single socket 8 or 12 core systems - These are pretty much standard now if you were to be purchasing a new system today that is made by AMD.

Will the licensing of VMWare change in the near future to reflect current technology??

[matvdl]

Just found the following - does this mean it won't install???

PC Hardware

The number of virtual machines you can run concurrently depends on the resources

they require. VMware Server supports up to 16‐way multiprocessor servers, with a

maximum of four virtual machines running concurrently per processor.

VMware Server hosts must meet the following requirements:

Standard x86‐compatible or x86‐64‐compatible server with up to 16 processors.

Hosts with 32‐bit IA‐32 processors and IA‐32 processors with 64‐bit extensions are

supported.

[golddiggie]

The free version of ESXi isn't as feature rich as the licensed versions (same install, just items are not unlocked without the correct license codes).

See this page to show what's supported/unlocked in the different license versions... As you can see, the Advanced and Enterprise Plus fully support up to 12 cores per socket... Otherwise you're locked to just six cores per socket. You should be able to install/run ESX/ESXi onto those systems, but you'll lose use of half the cores if you do...

As for VMware "getting current" they already are. When 8 and 12 core processors were being discussed, and "on the horizon" items, VMware was releasing the updated licenses that would support them. That's when they updated/released Enterprise Plus (with 12 core support)...

As for licenses for the VMware product being more than the cost of the servers... So what?? We're buying three new R710 hosts totaling around 15-16k and Enterprise Plus VMware licenses, coming in at just over 20k, plus SnS... If you cannot afford the software licenses, then you shouldn't be getting servers with that many cores. OR, you need to go to the people controlling the budgets and get the funds to do things up RIGHT.

Network Administrator

VMware VCP4

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[matvdl]

Thanks for your comments - if the install will work even though I have 12 cores than that would be great. It will provide a path forward.

In terms of "so what" - the "so what" really relates to what competitors are doing. If the VMware options are significantly more expensive than their competitors than people (like me) will be forced to look elsewhere - particularly when doing testing/development type activities.

So I would suggest they are behind the times. Small low cost systems with 12 cores will be charged significant amounts of money - on this type of system all that would be needed is Win 2008 server standard and you would be off and running with a VM environment - with VMware this would be significantly more expensive.

Not sure about the others competitors - but VMware will need to be careful they don't price themselves out of this market.

[golddiggie]

What "competitors"? VMware is up front with all their costs, not so with the others... With Hyper-V you have hidden costs all over the place. Citrix just plain sucks donkey private parts. VMware simply works, does what it says it will, for the long haul.

I've been running ESX/ESXi in my home lab for over two years straight now. Uptime is about 5 9's (only going down when I lost power long enough that the UPS was drained). With the hyper-v you'll have Windows updates that require reboots. Citrix is playing catch-up to VMware at every release (at least 6 months behind VMware). I wouldn't trust anything other than VMware in any environment, production OR test/dev...

As my current boss has said "no one will get fired for going with VMware..." Typically when the kid (about 21) starts hyping about hyper-v... Only because he's familiar with Windows, and has had zero training/instruction on ESX. The ONLY reason there's any hyper-v server in place is becuase it's included (for testing) in the MSDN subscription... If it's my technet, I wouldn't know, or care (haven't even bothered to see if it's on the list)...

Look at it this way... Do your graphic designers/artists/etc. complain about the price (and what you get) with the Adobe products? Adobe is another industry leader (who just so happened to have bought up a large section of the competition). Adobe also offeres tiered products. At least with VMware you install once and then features are unlocked depending on the key you use.

Network Administrator

VMware VCP4

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