Fusion display choppy if larger than 1024x768 - Macbook

[retro83]

After installing OSX 10.5.2 and the graphics update, the display on Fusion has been very choppy for instance when scrolling documents or moving windows around (in fullscreen or windowed mode). By choppy I mean that it feels almost like running a VNC session rather than interacting with a local machine.

I've noticed now that if I run the display in 1024x768 or less, then the graphics go back to how they were pre-10.5.2 - perfectly smooth.

Has anybody else noticed this or is it just me? The rest of OSX is now much smoother than before, it is just Fusion which is now choppy.

Also should I report this as a bug somewhere?

Thanks.

R.

PS. This is a Macbook SR 2.2GHz C2D with 2GB RAM and X3100 graphics.

[retro83]

Can confirm 100% this is related to 10.5.2's graphics update.

I did a fresh install of OSX and Fusion, then installed the 10.5.2 combo update. The VM was fast and smooth until I installed the graphics update, then it became slow and jerky.

My graphics card details follow:

Intel GMA X3100:

Chipset Model: GMA X3100

Type: Display

Bus: Built-In

VRAM (Total): 144 MB

Vendor: Intel (0x8086)

Device ID: 0x2a02

Revision ID: 0x0003

Displays:

Color LCD:

Display Type: LCD

Resolution: 1280 x 800

Depth: 32-bit Color

Built-In: Yes

Core Image: Hardware Accelerated

Main Display: Yes

Mirror: Off

Online: Yes

Quartz Extreme: Supported

Display Connector:

Status: No display connected

Hope this gets resolved soon!

Regards,

R. 83

[danfairs]

Yup - I'm seeing this too (I've got an eval copy of Fusion, Version 1.1 (62573) - my full copy is on the way from Amazon!

I've just updated to10.5.2 with the subsequent Leopard Graphics Update. Unfortunately I didn't run VMWare before the graphics update, so I can't say which caused it.

Here's my sytem info:Hardware Overview:

Model Name: MacBook

Model Identifier: MacBook3,1

Processor Name: Intel Core 2 Duo

Processor Speed: 2.2 GHz

Number Of Processors: 1

Total Number Of Cores: 2

L2 Cache: 4 MB

Memory: 4 GB

Bus Speed: 800 MHz

Boot ROM Version: MB31.008E.B01

Chipset Model: GMA X3100

Type: Display

Bus: Built-In

VRAM (Total): 144 MB

Vendor: Intel (0x8086)

Device ID: 0x2a02

Revision ID: 0x0003

Displays:

Color LCD:

Display Type: LCD

Resolution: 1280 x 800

Depth: 32-bit Color

Built-In: Yes

Core Image: Hardware Accelerated

Mirror: Off

Online: Yes

Quartz Extreme: Supported

DELL 2005FPW:

Resolution: 1680 x 1050 @ 60 Hz

Depth: 32-bit Color

Core Image: Hardware Accelerated

Main Display: Yes

Mirror: Off

Online: Yes

Quartz Extreme: Supported

Rotation: Supported

Note that I'm using VMware on the larger of the two screens. Moving to the smaller one doesn't make any difference - even dropping below 1024x768 as the OP suggested.

Basically, moving windows around is choppy.

Guest OS is Windows XP MCE SP2, with 1.5GB of RAM allocated to it.

Any pointers gratefully received - even if they involve software updates, as hopefully my copy of Fusion will turn up tomorrow!

[retro83]

I'm so glad that somebody else is experiencing this issue!

My solution for now is to avoid the graphics update :smileysad: It certainly seems to be caused by the new X3100 drivers.

I have submitted a bug report to Apple, under the number #5737987. I do not know where to submit a bug to VMWare, but hopefully between them they will fix this quickly!

Please reply if you make any progress...

[admin]

I filed this internally as bug 239210.

If anyone else sees this after applying the Leopard Graphics Update, or has a similar machine (MacBook with X3100 graphics) but does not see it after applying the update, that would be useful to know.

[retro83]

Thank you Etung!

[danfairs]

Just to update - I'm now running a fully licensed VMWare Fusion, and have upgraded to 1.1.1 - problem still occurring.

[retro83]

Sorry to bump this but I wondered if anybody had made any progress on the issue yet?

Surely it must be affecting quite a few users..? :_|

Thanks!

[iCV]

any news about this issue?

[pds2208]

I don't know what caused this but after updating to 10.5.2. & the graphics update, I find vmware to be unusable for some applications. Specifically I use the arkadin conference service, which uses Java, in windows xp and you can wait a long time while the screen redraws.

[admin]

...and what type of Mac do you have, and what version of Fusion?

[pds2208]

Macbook pro 2.4ghz / 4gb ram Fusion 1.1.1

[kd7290]

I can confirm on the graphics tearing after updating OS X with 10.5.2 and Graphics update. Running Fusion 1.1.1 Trial on MacBook Pro, 2.16GHz, 2GB RAM, ATI x1600

[admin]

Macbook pro 2.4ghz / 4gb ram Fusion 1.1.1

What graphics card?

For what it's worth, I have a MacBook Pro (GeForce 8600), 10.5.2+Leopard Graphics Update, Fusion 1.1.1, and don't see any tearing or slowness.

[Tentative]

I have the same problem.

I use the trial version of Fusion to play some little games like Worms on my MacBook. Everything was smooth until the 10.5.2 upgrade.

I was thinking about adding some ram (I have currently 1go ram).

But it seems not to be the problem finally.

I hope this will quickly be fixed, in the meanwhile, I think I'm going to reinstall leopard 10.5.1 or 10.5.2 without the graphics update.

[danfairs]

@Tentative: Did you do the reinstall without the graphics update? Did the problem recur without it, or do you still see it?

[retro83]

I reinstalled with all updates except the Graphics Update, and the issue was gone. After installing LGU 1.0 it was back :smileysad:

[danfairs]

Thanks for trying that.

@etung - this would seem to confirm that it's the graphics update that's responsible, and from reading the thread that MacBooks and MacBook Pros that don't use an nVidia chipset (etung, yours is the only report where this problem isn't happening, and that's with an nVidia card) are all affected, including Intel graphics and ATI graphics. Any update on this issue from VMWare?

[admin]

We've tried to reproduce this internally with an appropriate MacBook, but there might be something else going on because the result was "slightly choppier, but not terrible"

[retro83]

Thanks for your help, etung.

What extra information can we give to get this sorted?

The odd thing is that every single other app is faster with LGU 1.0.

I ran the Passmark 2D performance test in Fusion a few times, pre LGU gets 39.1 points consistently, and post-LGU get 48.2 so clearly something is working faster (~ 23% faster if my maths is correct!). Perceptually however, post LGU is much slower.

Scrolling a webpage, or the code editing window in visual studio is very annoying - because of the tearing you see things flash up on the screen after the window thinks it has scrolled past that point. Editing large documents becomes very annoying!

[Tentative]

Without Graphics Update everything runs quite well.

The problem occurs only with Graphics Update installed, on my MB.

[iCV]

I've the same problem on my MacBook C2D Santa Rosa 2,2GhZ X3100 Graphics

OSX 10.5.2 with LGU and Fusion 1.1.1

[tagq2]

Another thing to try out: on my educational iMac (17" white, with a GMA950) the Leopard graphics update seems to have harmed MSN video conferencing - where video and sound were previously smooth, video frequently pauses for a split second while a snippet of audio is repeated. Fully updated XP with Live Messenger 8.5, using either iSight or Quickcam Pro 4000, microphone connected via AK5370 USB device. Tried removing all USB peripherals bar either Bluetooth or wired keyboard/mouse.

[noetus]

I am encountering this problem as well... running Windows 2000 guest on Macbook Pro 2.33 GHz and display is badly choppy after upgrading to the new Graphics Update (drivers) on Mac OS. Wish I could run in Parallels until this is fixed, but disks are too large to convert.

[danfairs]

Anyone got any info if this issue still exists on the newly-released 1.1.2 with the LGU?

[retro83]

I will be testing it this afternoon. I have found a few apps which demo the problem really nicely, so I can post some videos on youtube for the devs to see if I get the chance.

[retro83]

Problem still occurs on Version 1.1.2 (87978).

I have taken some vids of my test case which show 60FPS on my Genesis emulator before the update, 35-40FPS after LGU 1.0 is applied.

The drop in frame rate doesn't show up too well on the vid because of my camera but I enabled the FPS counter in the game, and you can clearly see it is around 40% lower than before the LGU update.

The emulator I used was Fusion, the game was Sonic 2. I have a SR Macbook 2.2Ghz, 2GB RAM.

I can upload the vids if proof is needed, but they are unfortunately around 25MB each.

[danfairs]

I can confirm that the problem persists for me with 1.1.2 as well.

[retro83]

Problem still occurs on the new VMWare Fusion 2.0 BETA 1. I installed the new vmware tools + drivers and it makes no difference at all.

[retro83]

Problem still present in 10.5.3 and worse - LGU appears to built into 10.5.3 so it is no longer an option to avoid just the new graphics drivers.

[noetus]

Has this been filed internally as a bug yet? The last post from a VMWare person suggested that they weren't able to reproduce this issue.

Anyone know if this is on file?

Thanks

[retro83]

I reported it on this page: http://vmware.com/support/support_feedback.html

I never heard anything back though so I don't know what happened.

[admin]

It's being tracked as PR 239210, but unless we can get reproduction instructions or see an affected system, there's not much we can do.

[noetus]

In the case of those affected, having a larger display (in my case, 1920x1200) and installing the graphics update (which now apparently comes with 10.5.3) was sufficient to cause the issue. It doesn't appear to be specific to certain Windows OSes.

Earlier etung mentioned that on a test system (a MacBook Pro) there WAS video glitching but that it "wasn't terrible". Part of the problem seems to be that the judgement as to whether there is a problem or not is subjective. Are there any objective tests that we can run to determine whether there is a problem? And would a video of the choppiness posted to these forums help to establish what is terrible and what is merely bad but acceptable?

Also, if VMware's testers are seeing a problem, even if it is not really bad, surely that can be a start to investigating what the problem is?

Also I wonder if someone from VMware (etung or someone else) could specify a list of options to change to see whether the problem gets better or worse. (For example, graphics display size, memory size, what have you, I don't really know what these might be.) This might help narrow down what FURTHER conditions beyond "large screen, graphics update" is enough to trigger the issue. It seems to me that people at VMware might have a better idea as to what options to change to try and figure this out.

[danfairs]

I'd certainly be happy to help if VMWare could post some diagnostic steps to take.

[bgertzfield]

I wasn't able to reproduce this on my MacBook (Intel GMA X3100 chipset), but if it's related to the NVIDIA issue I just uncovered, the steps in this post may help diagnose the issue:

http://communities.vmware.com/thread/149178?tstart=0

I'll repost them in this thread as well:

===

Hey all,

I just found a pretty nasty 2D graphics performance issue with the Mac OS X 10.5.3 update and Macs with NVIDIA chipsets. (This is very apparent on the Mac Pro with NVIDIA GeForce 7300 GT).

If you run your VM at any "non-standard" resolution (anything that isn't a multiple of 32 bytes wide), then 2D performance will suffer: dragging windows around will seem awfully slow.

We plan to have a fix in the next Fusion 2.0 release. For now, if you want to get the best 2D graphics performance with Mac OS X 10.5.3, please go into your VM's settings and ensure your VM's display is set to one of the standard resolutions (1024 x 768, 1280 x 1024, 1440 x 900, etc. -- anything that's a multiple of 8 pixels wide with 32 bit color should do.)

Alternatively, you can edit or create the file:

~/Library/Preferences/VMware Fusion/config

and add the lines:

mks.gl.textureRange = "FALSE"

mks.gl.storageHintShared = "FALSE"

With these settings disabled, your 2D performance won't be quite as good as before the 10.5.3 update, but it'll be quite usable. Please remember to turn these settings back on when you try out the next Fusion 2.0 release!

Sorry for the inconvenience.

===

[retro83]

If you run your VM at any "non-standard" resolution (anything that isn't a multiple of 32 bytes wide), then 2D performance will suffer: dragging windows around will seem awfully slow.

We plan to have a fix in the next Fusion 2.0 release. For now, if you want to get the best 2D graphics performance with Mac OS X 10.5.3, please go into your VM's settings and ensure your VM's display is set to one of the standard resolutions (1024 x 768, 1280 x 1024, 1440 x 900, etc. -- anything that's a multiple of 8 pixels wide with 32 bit color should do.)

Wow, running the window at a 'standard' resolution makes moving windows around smooth again!

and add the lines:

mks.gl.textureRange = "FALSE"

mks.gl.storageHintShared = "FALSE"

This doesn't seem to help me at all.

PS. on my system without the above workaround it looks something like this when dragging a window around:

Thanks for the help!!

PS. I'm seeing this problem on a Macbook with a X3100 GPU.

[danfairs]

retro83 - did you see the improvement while still on 10.5.2, or after your upgrade?

I'm on a Macbook with the same hardware, have yet to update to 10.5.3, but still see the tearing windows even at 32-bit colour at one of the previously mentioned resolutions.

[retro83]

Dan - it was after installing 10.5.3. Let me be clear though - it is still not as good as before 10.5.2. I was just really happy because it made the environment tolerable for work again. Also, I discovered I need to have the dock at the side rather than at the bottom in order to see the benefit.

[jegbook]

I have a 2.2GHz MacBook (SR) w/ 4GB of RAM and have not had any video issues with Fusion at all. A number of times I've even used an external monitor and put Fusion in full screen (1280x1024) on the external. Most of the time I run it at full screen on my MacBook (1280x800).

FWIW, I've never given the VM less the 1GB of RAM, currently 1.25. Don't know if that would make a difference.

I started using Fusion on day 1 with my MacBook in November, so that would have been 10.5.1. I haven't had any problems along the way and nothing but a great experience.

Could it make any difference if it's a full VM or a Boot Camp partition? I use my Boot Camp partition.

Oh, I've always kept my Dock on the left side. Even if on the bottom, though, I've used TinkerTool to turn of the Leopard Dock craziness.

Any questions feel free to ask.

[bgertzfield]

I have a 2.2GHz MacBook (SR) w/ 4GB of RAM and have not had any video issues with Fusion at all. A number of times I've even used an external monitor and put Fusion in full screen (1280x1024) on the external. Most of the time I run it at full screen on my MacBook (1280x800).

I think the fact that your resolutions are all multiples of 32 bytes wide is what makes it speedy.

Ben

[jegbook]

While it is true that 1280x800 or 1280x1024 are all multiples of 32, what does that say about a number of users with similar MacBooks that are having the problem?

Is the problem only while dragging windows around? Or is video generally slow overall? e.g.- streaming content from Netflix would be choppy? (I'm able to stream Netflix content without issue).

Perhaps going to the Advanced tab of System Properties and clicking on the Performance Settings button and deselecting the option to show window contents while dragging? My company deselects all options in the performance settings to speed up Windows performance in general. Likely not a real fix, but perhaps a temporary workaround.

I did just select "Show window contents while dragging" and seemed to be able reproduce lag/choppiness/lack of "smooth" window dragging. The dragging of the window is fast, but I get a trail of windows (sort of like mouse tracks). If that is indeed the issue, it would seem turning this option off is an easy solution, and generally good practice anyway. Even booting directly into Windows via Boot Camp I don't know what that kind of performance would be like.

YMMV.

[retro83]

I did just select "Show window contents while dragging" and seemed to be able reproduce lag/choppiness/lack of "smooth" window dragging. The dragging of the window is fast, but I get a trail of windows (sort of like mouse tracks). If that is indeed the issue, it would seem turning this option off is an easy solution, and generally good practice anyway. Even booting directly into Windows via Boot Camp I don't know what that kind of performance would be like

Maybe that would help -but the point is that this only started after the Leopard Graphics Update in 10.5.2 - before it was silky smooth no matter what settings were used.

This is also how it works on my vastly less powerful Windows PC, and my Linux box. This is a specific problem caused by some interaction between Fusion and the updated graphics drivers.

[bgertzfield]

I did just select "Show window contents while dragging" and seemed to be able reproduce lag/choppiness/lack of "smooth" window dragging. The dragging of the window is fast, but I get a trail of windows (sort of like mouse tracks). If that is indeed the issue, it would seem turning this option off is an easy solution, and generally good practice anyway.

I assume this is with a custom resolution, right? You mentioned earlier that the problem goes away when you run at one of the built-in Windows resolutions, if I understand correctly.

If so, the bug is fixed internally, and the fix will be present in the next Fusion 2.0 release.

[danfairs]

Hi,

I've updated to Mac OS X 10.5.5 and VMWare Fusion 2.0, and I still experience significant tearing when moving windows around. This is using a Black MacBook, 2.2GHz Core 2 Duo, 4GB RAM, with an Intel GMA X3100 graphics chipset. The VM is running XP SP 2, fullscreen at 1680x1050. Tearing is still visible at a 'standard' resolution, such as 1024x768.

Thanks.

[retro83]

Same here. At least for now, I have given up on VMWare on OSX, and started using boot camp instead.

[jegbook]

Out of curiousity, are folks out there (regardless of computer) setting Fusion to use accelerated 3D graphics? Though, it would seem logical that this setting shouldn't affect 2D support.

I recently updated to 10.5.5 and Fusion 2betaRC1. I still haven't had any trouble. I also didn't have any trouble when running Vista Ultimate as a VM (also with 3D support turned off).

For folks having the issue, will it still happen with a clean OS (nothing but OS and Fusion installed)? It seems given that some folks have the issue and many don't, that there is some connection, and hardware doesn't seem to be it. But it would be interesting if folks that have had the problem could create a scenario where it didn't happen. Using an external FW HD to install Leopard onto and then Fusion, boot off that, would give an opportunity to test the theory.

Good luck, all.

I also argue that turning off "show window contents while dragging" seems a reasonable workaround.

[danfairs]

Changing the 3D acceleration setting seems to have no effect on the problem.

Your workaround is fine for moving windows around, but the tearing also happens while scrolling text and web pages (this is actually the most annoying problem, since I spend most of my Windows time in Visual Studio - scrolling text files around!)

[bgertzfield]

I've updated to Mac OS X 10.5.5 and VMWare Fusion 2.0, and I still experience significant tearing when moving windows around. This is using a Black MacBook, 2.2GHz Core 2 Duo, 4GB RAM, with an Intel GMA X3100 graphics chipset. The VM is running XP SP 2, fullscreen at 1680x1050. Tearing is still visible at a 'standard' resolution, such as 1024x768.

Hi Dan,

You can turn on vsync to fix the tearing issue (which also slows down mouse responsiveness) by editing the file:

~/Library/Preferences/VMware Fusion/config

and adding the line:

mks.vsync = "1"

Suspend and resume your VMs, and the tearing should go away.

[danfairs]

I'm afraid that didn't work for me. The config file doesn't exist; creating it and adding that line didn't have any effect. The only file that was present in that directory is a 'preferences' file. Adding the line to that also has no effect.

[qazwsxedcrfv123]

It seems that whaterver I do, the choppy/lagging graphics persist. This is very frustrating as I rely on trading sofware for quick and accurate data but I do not feel they are displayed as the data is streaming.

I have changed the graphics resolution but was unable to find "~/Library/Preferences/VMware Fusion/config". I don't have a WMware Fusion/config folder.

I have recently purchased a new MacBook Pro and need to run Windows XP for my trading software. I installed Fusion 1.1.3 and tired the 2.0.0 version as well. Neither show fluid graphics and both exhibit delays when moving windows and/or changing applications. I have Mac OS X, V 10.5.3, 2.6 GHz IntelCore Duo, 4 GB Ram.

I have contacted VMware 3 days ago and no one has replied.

Can anyone help please, can someone contact me from VMware? I would like to solve this problem and am willing to pay for support although online suport is free for one month.....

I am also available at [e-mail] or by phone at 720 937 3443.Thanks in advance.

[qazwsxedcrfv123]

I did manage to edit the config file: no change in graphics. I wander if there is a driver update i need for my current set-up:

Chipset Model: GeForce 8600M GT

Type: Display

Bus: PCIe

PCIe Lane Width: x16

VRAM (Total): 512 MB

Vendor: NVIDIA (0x10de)

Device ID: 0x0407

Revision ID: 0x00a1

ROM Revision: 3212

Displays:

Color LCD:

Display Type: LCD

Resolution: 1344 x 840

Depth: 32-bit Color

Built-In: Yes

Core Image: Hardware Accelerated

Main Display: Yes

Mirror: Off

Online: Yes

Quartz Extreme: Supported

SyncMaster:

Resolution: 1280 x 1024 @ 60 Hz

Depth: 32-bit Color

Core Image: Hardware Accelerated

Mirror: Off

Online: Yes

Quartz Extreme: Supported

Rotation: Supported

Has anyone contated apple for a possible graphic chip driver issue?

[bgertzfield]

I have recently purchased a new MacBook Pro and need to run Windows XP for my trading software. I installed Fusion 1.1.3 and tired the 2.0.0 version as well. Neither show fluid graphics and both exhibit delays when moving windows and/or changing applications. I have Mac OS X, V 10.5.3, 2.6 GHz IntelCore Duo, 4 GB Ram.

This is a bug in Mac OS X, for which VMware Fusion 2.0 (now in beta) contains a workaround.

You can download the beta from:

http://communities.vmware.com/community/beta/fusion

Good luck!

[qazwsxedcrfv123]

bgertfield:

Thanks for your reply. I have tried the beta verison and still have the problem. I have spent many hours researching/reloding/reconfiguring stuff. I'm at a total loss. Is there someone at VMware I can speak to? I have sent a request last week and no one has emailed or called back. What's ironic is that I live 10 minutes from your Broomfied Colorado office! Again, I am willing to PAY someone to fix this issue if I can find someone competent. My other choice is to try Parallels....

Thanks,

Peter: [e-mail]